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--- lb:lilith [2025-07-20 06:31:01] – [Lucifer] ninjasr
+++ lb:lilith [2026-02-26 09:25:32] (current) – [Lilith] ninjasr
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 ====== Lilith ======
+<div subtitle>
+{{tag>mythology worldbuilding}}
+</div>
+<div passage>
+<dfn>Lilith</dfn> is a character in [[lb:Abrahamic mythology|Abrahamic folklore]] who is interesting for having been poofed into existence due to a misunderstanding.
-Lilith is a character in Abrahamic folklore who is interesting for having been poofed into existence due to a misunderstanding.\\  Since that misunderstanding, though, Lilith has become quite popular((:fn:>Especially among feminists, but I'm not gonna get too into that...at least I hope so.)) and has had a habit of popping up all over the place.\\  It really isn't hard to see why Lilith is so popular. Even ignoring the //very// loose adaptations...well, there's a lot of mystique surrounding her in the Biblical narrative: What's the deal with her and Adam? What about her and Eve? Why did she leave? Did she leave of her own will? Is there some drama? Etc.\\  It should be noted that Lilith isn't really 'canon' to any major/mainstream [[playground:Christianity|Christian]] beliefs...which is completely reasonable.((:fn:>Though I should note that the original demon/monster that Lilith is derived from may still be considered canon.)) Among the other Abrahamic faiths...well, Jews don't really //do// 'canon' in a Christian sense, so she's either taken seriously or not...I can't really comment on how much each position is believed however. Islam and the others appear to not know what a Lilith is.
+Since that misunderstanding, though, Lilith has become quite popular((:fn:>Especially among feminists, but I'm not gonna get too into that...at least I hope so.)) and has had a habit of popping up all over the place.
+</div>
-{{tag>mythology worldbuilding}}
+It really isn't hard to see why Lilith is so popular. Even ignoring the //very// loose adaptations...well, there's a lot of mystique surrounding her in the Biblical narrative: What's the deal with her and Adam? What about her and Eve? Why did she leave? Did she leave of her own will? Is there some drama? Etc.
+It should be noted that Lilith isn't really 'canon' to any major/mainstream [[playground:Christianity|Christian]] beliefs...which is completely reasonable.((:fn:>Though I should note that the original demon/monster that Lilith is derived from may still be considered canon.)) Among the other Abrahamic faiths...well, Jews don't really //do// 'canon' in a Christian sense, so she's either taken seriously or not...I can't really comment on how much each position is believed however. Islam and the others appear to not know what a Lilith is.
 ===== Description & Notes =====
@@ Line 35: / Line 42: @@
 ===== Media Depictions =====
+==== Chronicles of Darkness ====
+I initially thought that she doesn't appear at all but, after reading a bit more...yeah, she doesn't appear directly, but she //is// mentioned.
+Lilith is the progenitor of the [[lb:cod:Daeva]] clan of vampires. Though the details of that are lost to time.
 ==== Evangelion ====
-I originally had //waaaaay// more written here, but I realized it really derailed the article, so I moved it over to the [[lb:evangelion#lilithabrahamicthemes|Evangelion article]] where it fits far better.\\  A summary would be that Lilith is the <wrap spoiler>progenitor of mankind</wrap> and, perhaps surprisingly, her Abrahamic folklore is way more thematically relevant to Evangelion than may initially be apparent.
+I originally had //waaaaay// more written here, but I realized it really derailed the article, so I moved it over to the [[lb:evangelion#lilithabrahamicthemes|Evangelion article]] where it fits far better.\\  A summary would be that Lilith is the <mark spoiler>progenitor of mankind</mark> and, perhaps surprisingly, her Abrahamic folklore is way more thematically relevant to Evangelion than may initially be apparent.
 ==== In Nomine ====
@@ Line 50: / Line 60: @@
 ==== World of Darkness ====
-{{wst>main|lb:wod}} Most of my information comes from 1d6chan, the White Wolf wiki and...yeah, that's about it. Despite that...\\  There really isn't much about Lilith in the grand scheme of things. There is //something// here, but not much of it.((:fn:>I'm noting this in a footnote for now, but there is actually more here than I realized. Lilith has quite a bit written about her in the Gehenna book (which is after [[playground:Revelations of the Dark Mother]] but whatever) which elaborates a bit on her.))\\  Here is what's known for sure about Lilith: she was part of the Garden of Eden, which she left, though we can’t be sure why.((:fn:>Yes, I know. We'll get to it.)) At some point during her travels she met Lucifer who taught her magic.((:fn:>It's here that she may or may not have banged Lucifer, it's not really clear. She may have also banged big G but...I seriously doubt that because I cannot even begin to imagine what kind of situation could have arisen for that to occur.)) She and Lucifer separated and wandered around some more until she met Caine. She took pity on him and decided to be with him. Via her magic, she helped teach Caine stuff about his own supernatural abilities. Unfortunately, Caine was still an asshole, so he eventually left her. Lilith may or may not have ever forgiven him for this. Alone again, Lilith decided to create her own Garden of Eden with a seed she //probably// received from Lucifer.\\  The most consistent first-hand characterization we get of her is from her end-time scenario for Vampire, where she wants to kill Caine.((:fn:>That grudge lasted a while.)) The players are tasked by her to help her with this task.\\  Whether she succeeds or fails is, of course, up to the players but if she succeeds and the players kill Caine...well, the players will not be able to enter Heaven but she'll be nice and let them stay in her garden. She can also fail catastrophically, though you should read that on 1d6chan instead.\\  This is where the clear stuff ends and where the crazy stuff begins. The stuff that I have relayed to you, dear reader, is stuff that I would consider ‘unambiguously canon’ while the stuff I will relate to you now is stuff I'd consider ‘absolutely non-canon’ due to the fact this information comes from [[playground:Revelations of the Dark Mother]], which I plan to read at some point to assess the damage. That book was written by [[1d6>Phil Brucato]]. If you want to know about him well, first, read that 1d6chan page and then consider the fact he is called ‘GoatFucker’.\\  But, basically, that book is centered around what the worshippers of Lilith believe about Lilith. And those worshippers of Lilith are completely insane. They are BDSM-obsessed misandrists who lean on the S part of BDSM. For example, they believe that Adam attempted to or succeeded in raping Lilith, which is why she left Eden. I find that unlikely, but I digress. They also believe that she had banged Eve (as the snake no less), Lucifer and God himself. If you can figure that out...yeah.\\  There are some other weird things that come from that...like the fact Lilith is the first woman and Eve is the third.\\  From a worldbuilding standpoint that's just really weird no matter how you look at it. Lilith's whole thing is that she's the //mysterious first woman// and Eve is the second woman that everyone else is descended from. Adding a third woman on top of that just...well, at that point why even stop at three? Just make 12 women.\\  Now, excluding that insanity...we can’t really be sure //why// Lilith left the Garden of Eden (or got kicked out). We can’t really be sure of anything about her, honestly, she's a mystery in WoD just like in the folklore...just slightly less of a mystery.\\  This Lilith is also quite sympathetic, since she gets abandoned (allegedly) by every person she loves. She can even fail her end-time scenario which, granted, is a murder plot...but still.\\  I don't have much to say conclusively. This version of Lilith is still mysterious, but does have a more sympathetic edge, so I guess she's a good source of inspiration in that regard.\\  Also...I don't know for sure, but I don't think Lilith makes an appearance in the [[lb:cod]] which is unsurprising.
+{{wst>main|lb:wod}} Most of my information comes from 1d6chan, the White Wolf wiki and...yeah, that's about it. Despite that...\\  There really isn't much about Lilith in the grand scheme of things. There is //something// here, but not much of it.((:fn:>I'm noting this in a footnote for now, but there is actually more here than I realized. Lilith has quite a bit written about her in the Gehenna book (which is after [[playground:Revelations of the Dark Mother]] but whatever) which elaborates a bit on her.))\\  Here is what's known for sure about Lilith: she was part of the Garden of Eden, which she left, though we can’t be sure why.((:fn:>Yes, I know. We'll get to it.)) At some point during her travels she met Lucifer who taught her magic.((:fn:>It's here that she may or may not have banged Lucifer, it's not really clear. She may have also banged big G but...I seriously doubt that because I cannot even begin to imagine what kind of situation could have arisen for that to occur.)) She and Lucifer separated and wandered around some more until she met Caine. She took pity on him and decided to be with him. Via her magic, she helped teach Caine stuff about his own supernatural abilities. Unfortunately, Caine was still an asshole, so he eventually left her. Lilith may or may not have ever forgiven him for this. Alone again, Lilith decided to create her own Garden of Eden with a seed she //probably// received from Lucifer.\\  The most consistent first-hand characterization we get of her is from her end-time scenario for Vampire, where she wants to kill Caine.((:fn:>That grudge lasted a while.)) The players are tasked by her to help her with this task.\\  Whether she succeeds or fails is, of course, up to the players but if she succeeds and the players kill Caine...well, the players will not be able to enter Heaven but she'll be nice and let them stay in her garden. She can also fail catastrophically, though you should read that on 1d6chan instead.\\  This is where the clear stuff ends and where the crazy stuff begins. The stuff that I have relayed to you, dear reader, is stuff that I would consider ‘unambiguously canon’ while the stuff I will relate to you now is stuff I'd consider ‘absolutely non-canon’ due to the fact this information comes from [[playground:Revelations of the Dark Mother]], which I plan to read at some point to assess the damage. That book was written by [[1d6>Phil Brucato]]. If you want to know about him well, first, read that 1d6chan page and then consider the fact he is called ‘GoatFucker’.\\  But, basically, that book is centered around what the worshippers of Lilith believe about Lilith. And those worshippers of Lilith are completely insane. They are BDSM-obsessed misandrists who lean on the S part of BDSM. For example, they believe that Adam attempted to or succeeded in raping Lilith, which is why she left Eden. I find that unlikely, but I digress. They also believe that she had banged Eve (as the snake no less), Lucifer and God himself. If you can figure that out...yeah.\\  There are some other weird things that come from that...like the fact Lilith is the first woman and Eve is the third.\\  From a worldbuilding standpoint that's just really weird no matter how you look at it. Lilith's whole thing is that she's the //mysterious first woman// and Eve is the second woman that everyone else is descended from. Adding a third woman on top of that just...well, at that point why even stop at three? Just make 12 women.\\  Now, excluding that insanity...we can’t really be sure //why// Lilith left the Garden of Eden (or got kicked out). We can’t really be sure of anything about her, honestly, she's a mystery in WoD just like in the folklore...just slightly less of a mystery.\\  This Lilith is also quite sympathetic, since she gets abandoned (allegedly) by every person she loves. She can even fail her end-time scenario which, granted, is a murder plot...but still.\\  I don't have much to say conclusively. This version of Lilith is still mysterious, but does have a more sympathetic edge, so I guess she's a good source of inspiration in that regard.\\
 ===== Worldbuilding Notes =====