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lb:umineko [2025-10-08 06:26:47] – ninjasrlb:umineko [2025-10-20 14:02:12] (current) – [The Red Truths] Re-formatted the presentation to be more aesthetically pleasing. Also fixed an error. ninjasr
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 **うみねこのなく{{ruby|頃|ころ}}に**(When the Seagulls Cry) is a multi-media franchise that started with a [[lb:visual novels|Visual Novel]] but has since expanded into a bunch of other stuff, like an [[lb:anime]], [[lb:manga]] and [[lb:light novels]].\\  I was trying to get into it and I find parts of it interesting, but I honestly don't like Umineko. Read more about it below! **うみねこのなく{{ruby|頃|ころ}}に**(When the Seagulls Cry) is a multi-media franchise that started with a [[lb:visual novels|Visual Novel]] but has since expanded into a bunch of other stuff, like an [[lb:anime]], [[lb:manga]] and [[lb:light novels]].\\  I was trying to get into it and I find parts of it interesting, but I honestly don't like Umineko. Read more about it below!
  
-<WRAP caution center-text>+<div caution center-text>
  
 **This article has unmarked spoilers, so keep that in mind if you want to go thru Umineko. Though I don't recommend it.** **This article has unmarked spoilers, so keep that in mind if you want to go thru Umineko. Though I don't recommend it.**
  
-</WRAP> +</div>
- +
-<WRAP caution> +
- +
-While I've released it in its current state, I think there is still some proofreading needed. Once I read thru it twice (which I won't do today), I'll remove this warning. +
- +
-By then I should have removed any issues. +
- +
-</WRAP> +
 {{tag>anime manga visual_novels}} {{tag>anime manga visual_novels}}
  
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 //Umineko//'s story is split into different metaphysical layers. Each of those is further split down. There are basically ≈3 main layers which are then further split up. Below is a visual representation. //Umineko//'s story is split into different metaphysical layers. Each of those is further split down. There are basically ≈3 main layers which are then further split up. Below is a visual representation.
- +<div card vstack> 
-<WRAP card vstack center-text> +^  Implied Layer((:fn:> This layer is implied and I read something on the wiki to suggest its existence, but I haven’t personally witnessed it in any of the story I’ve gone thru.))                                                                        |||||||| 
- +^  Witch's Game                                                                                                                                                                                                                                             |||||||| 
-<WRAP header> +^  The Games                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                |||||||| 
- +|  Game 1                                                                                                                                                                             |  Game 2  |  Game 3  |  Game 4  |  Game 5  |  Game 6  |  Game 7  |  Game 8  | 
-Implied Layer((:fn:>This layer is implied and I read something on the wiki to suggest its existence, but I haven't personally witnessed it in any of the story I've gone thru.)) +^  Ange's Layer                                                                                                                                                                                                                                             |||||||| 
- +^  Reality                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                  |||||||| 
-</WRAP> +</div>
- +
-<WRAP header> +
- +
-The Witch's Game +
- +
-</WRAP> +
- +
-<WRAP header> +
- +
-The Games +
- +
-</WRAP> +
- +
-<WRAP hstack> +
- +
-Game 1 +
- +
-Game 2 +
- +
-Game 3 +
- +
-Game 4 +
- +
-Game 5 +
- +
-Game 6 +
- +
-Game 7 +
- +
-Game 8 +
- +
-</WRAP> +
- +
-<WRAP header> +
- +
-Ange's Layer +
- +
-</WRAP> +
- +
-<WRAP header> +
- +
-Reality +
- +
-</WRAP> +
- +
-</WRAP> +
 Now keep in mind that each of those (sans Reality and the top-most layer) is also further split something like this: Now keep in mind that each of those (sans Reality and the top-most layer) is also further split something like this:
  
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 Now let's explain it. Let's assume we have the following Red Truth: **Jessica killed Rudolph.** Now let's explain it. Let's assume we have the following Red Truth: **Jessica killed Rudolph.**
  
-Most people would assume that that means that Rudolph was killed by Jessica, right? However, because a Red Truth is fine as long as one of any possible interpretations is true...heh.\\  //Who// is ‘Jessica’? Does it refer to the person whose name it is? Does it refer to someone pretending to be Jessica? Does it refer to a persona taken up by another person? Is it a fictional character? Is it even a person?\\  //What// does ‘killed’ actually mean? Does it mean that someone was literally killed? Does it mean that someone was killed metaphorically? Is ‘killed’ hyperbolic? //Who// is ‘Rudolph’? We already went over that.+Most people would assume that that means that Rudolph was killed by Jessica, right? However, because a Red Truth is fine as long as one of any possible interpretations is true...heh.\\  //Who// is ‘Jessica’? Does it refer to the person whose name it is? Does it refer to someone pretending to be Jessica? Does it refer to a persona taken up by another person? Is it a fictional character? Is it even a person?\\  //What// does ‘killed’ actually mean? Does it mean that someone was literally killed? Does it mean that someone was killed metaphorically? Is ‘killed’ hyperbolic?\\ 
 +//Who// is ‘Rudolph’? //We already went over that//.
  
 Because of how much is up to interpretation, it's entirely possible that nobody died and neither Jessica nor Rudolph were involved. And somehow George is dead. Because of how much is up to interpretation, it's entirely possible that nobody died and neither Jessica nor Rudolph were involved. And somehow George is dead.
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 Let's make a list of Red Truths: Let's make a list of Red Truths:
 +<div card vstack warning center-text>
 +**Janet died in the room.**
  
-  * **Janet died in the room.** +**Janet was dead in the kitchen.**
-  * **Janet was dead in the kitchen.** +
-  * **Janet was killed by Katie.** +
-  * **The murder was committed with a knife.** +
-  * **Janet didn't die by suicide.** +
-  * **Janet died at 12:00.** +
-  * **Janet made tea at 1:00 PM.**+
  
 +**Janet was killed by Katie.**
 +
 +**The murder was committed with a knife.**
 +
 +**Janet didn't die by suicide.**
 +
 +**Janet died at 12:00.**
 +
 +**Janet made tea at 1:00 PM.**
 +</div>
 Now, keep in mind that the story itself reportedly does what I'm about to do. This may look pretty “case-closed”, but remember that a Red Truth is true as long as one of any interpretations is true. Now, keep in mind that the story itself reportedly does what I'm about to do. This may look pretty “case-closed”, but remember that a Red Truth is true as long as one of any interpretations is true.
  
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 //Umineko// breaks its promise to the audience – of being a mystery story with solvable mysteries – by being narratively incoherent. Because what happens in Umineko can be interpreted any way you desire – because there is //literally// no way to tell what is or isn't real – that means that Umineko has //many// (to put it lightly) possible interpretations. And since there's no way to tell which interpretation is better or worse, that means that there is no actual solution to any of the mysteries. //Umineko// breaks its promise to the audience – of being a mystery story with solvable mysteries – by being narratively incoherent. Because what happens in Umineko can be interpreted any way you desire – because there is //literally// no way to tell what is or isn't real – that means that Umineko has //many// (to put it lightly) possible interpretations. And since there's no way to tell which interpretation is better or worse, that means that there is no actual solution to any of the mysteries.
  
-That isn't even mentioning the fact that Umineko breaks the rules of fair play – it cites the Knox Decalogue but the official solution violates it. Even if we consider that the Knox Decalogue isn't absolute, Umineko still fails to be fair because everything can be interpreted however you want.+That isn't even mentioning the fact that Umineko breaks the rules of fair play – it cites the [[lb:Knox Decalogue]] but the official solution violates it. Even if we consider that the Knox Decalogue isn't absolute, Umineko still fails to be fair because everything can be interpreted however you want.
  
 At best it misleads the audience with the Red Truths and at worst it straight-up lies to them. Some people might think that insulting the audience by lying to them is a good (or neutral) thing and those people are, frankly, not very smart. At best it misleads the audience with the Red Truths and at worst it straight-up lies to them. Some people might think that insulting the audience by lying to them is a good (or neutral) thing and those people are, frankly, not very smart.
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     * Well, I decided to keep going for a while but Episode 6 //really got on my nerves// particularly because, being aware of the issues, it was hard to get invested into anything.     * Well, I decided to keep going for a while but Episode 6 //really got on my nerves// particularly because, being aware of the issues, it was hard to get invested into anything.
   * One of the reasons I became curious about //Umineko// is because I found out Ryukishi07 was to write the new [[lb:silent hill]] game (ƒ). But since experiencing //Umineko//, my interest has completely dissipated. I'm convinced it can’t be a good game now.   * One of the reasons I became curious about //Umineko// is because I found out Ryukishi07 was to write the new [[lb:silent hill]] game (ƒ). But since experiencing //Umineko//, my interest has completely dissipated. I'm convinced it can’t be a good game now.
 +  * I think my proofreading caught most of the obvious issues, so I'll just pretend it's fine until someone points an issue out. 
 +  * I noticed another potential problem with Umineko: its rendering of the [[lb:knox.decalogue]]. Though I told myself I wouldn't think too hard about Umineko anymore, all I'll say is that Umineko presents them as way more absolute than they actually are.
  
lb/umineko.1759904807.txt.gz · Last modified: 2025-10-08 06:26:47 by ninjasr
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